Blue Sky On Mars

And I guess you’re a tool of the liberal left. Why can’t you get over your hatred of Bush?
So what if oil money got Bush where he is. I’m sure Kerry isn’t crying because his wife is rich. Well, yeah he is, because he can’t use her money to campaign. I find that so funny.
I have an idea. Why don’t you come up with some tangient thoughts of your own instead of relying on what the liberals tell you to say.
Post something like this again, and I’ll makea fool out of you again.

First off, thanks for the comment. I do enjoy getting contrary opinions.

I’m not a tool of the liberal left (or at least the traditional liberals), because I consider myself to be a fiscal conservative. That said, I don’t think the way we’ve managed the environment is sustainable and could lead to serious issues, even within my lifetime.

Often, I post links to stories that I find interesting and wanted to keep track of. I don’t always have time to write up a long discourse on my views.

In this particular case, I actually did bother to write some thoughts of my own. Bush has been tossing around billions to programs that make money for the oil and defense industries (both of which he and Cheney have strong ties to). How about spending $100 billion on solar power research? That much money, if spent well, could probably produce some serious breakthroughs in efficiency and make solar power generation feasible for a good chunk of the population. Solar, of course, is only one option.

People would have a hard time spending $100 billion without wasting 80% of it. As a fiscal conservative, I would advocate doling out the money in a way that requires results for funding to move on.

Rather than just calling me a “tool” (or a fool), how about tossing out some real opinions on the problem. Let me know why it’s a wise course of action to continue relying on fossil fuels, and I’ll consider your viewpoint then.

Well, I agree with you Kevin. Unfortunetly, you can’t count on cloudy-headed fools to see things clearly, especially when they are simply influenced by CNN.

Drilling in Alaska (which passed the Senate today), will not create jobs, nor will it reduce our use of foreign oil, it will simply please oil makers by giving them another outlet for oil.

Hey Doug, I think everything you’re coming up with was placed in your head by the wacky Righties, so shut up about the “liberal left”, I’m willing to bet money you don’t even know what liberal means, seems that most people don’t anymore.

I bet you drive a pice of shit car.

Drililng in Alaska will help our economy a great deal. So you shut up.

That seems like too obvious a troll to respond to. “Drilling in Alaska will help our economy a great deal” is a statement of the uninformed. What does it buy us? Half a year’s supply, that’s all.

A lot of people don’t seem to realize that without trees *we die*. All of us. Dead.

As far as my car goes, I drive a fairly fuel efficient car, but it’s by no means a piece of shit. Look at the rest of my blog. I’m a software developer. That’s not a profession known for inability to buy a car.

Not only will it help with gas prices, which hurt everyone in this country in some form or fashion, but drilling Alaska will create hundreds of thousands of jobs. I believe we should do further research on solar power, because it will drop oil prices when our homes begin to use solar energy, however what will we use for our cars? No matter what we do, we still need oil. Do you think we should continue to rely on terrorist nations…such as Iraq and Saudi Arabia…for our oil in the future, or would you rather us drill Alaska and spend our money on our economy, not someone elses???

How about this - we are currently occupying an enemy nation that is swimming in oil. Why the hell aren’t we taking that? Is it theirs simply because they live above it? Throughout all the history of the world, resources have become the property of those with the means to take them. Why not enslave the people of Iraq so that I only have to pay ten cents a gallon for fuel?

I’m sure the hippies would lash out, but it won’t stop them from enjoying the cheap gas.

That has got to be flamebait, right? Sure, we have the means to take the oil from Iraq, but I don’t think we have the means to maintain that position in the face of the retaliation from nearly every other nation in the developed world. (I’d imagine we could get Tony Blair to buy into that plan…)

Well, we could offer China discount oil in order to appease them. Or better yet, tell China that if they want free oil too, all they have to do is raid some other Arab country. I’m sure they could handle it.

Look at China’s history, and the history of every other powerful nation in the world. Every time that had enough money and resources, they attempted to take over the world. Why is it that America has to be a gentle giant and give money and aid to everyone? We own Iraq and yet I’m paying 2.25 a gallon for gas. It makes no sense. I want free gas and I don’t care how many America-hating Muslims have to pay for it. You think they’ll hate us any less because we don’t take the oil? It makes no difference politically.

The 20th century changed the view of empire-building, I think. Most people in a democracy *want* peace and economic stability. The more people that live in a democracy (or republic) and that are relatively prosperous, the lower the likelihood that armed conflict will be received well.

America doesn’t *have* to give aid to everyone. I’d imagine that there are political motivations behind most aid that the government gives. Americans didn’t *have* to personally donate billions to tsunami relief, and the government didn’t *have* to provide direct help with relief efforts… but sometimes it feels good to lend a helping hand.

Your $2.25 a gallon sob story is pretty weak in the face of the fact that Iraqis are dying every day because of continued strife and unemployment there is out of control.

At least drilling in Alaska (the original point of this topic) is taking our own resources, rather than those of another group of people. How about this parallel: if you’re so distraught over $2.25 a gallon gas, why don’t you start siphoning the gas from your neighbors’ tanks. See how well that goes over. Or you could stage your own armed takeover of a gas station.

Honestly, I do think Muslims will hate us less if we leave Iraq in a better state than it was in when we arrived (and if we stop mistreating prisoners). Bush had talked about us liberating Iraq from Saddam… and yes, that’s a good thing. But the country has been in a shambles since we liberated it two years ago.

I’m very pleased to have an intelligent conversation with a hippy. I suppose my points are pretty blunt, arrogant, and short-sighted, but at least the writing is pretty good. It is a pleasant surprise after being taught by Bill O’Reilly that liberals are the stupidest people in the world.

Anyway, you make good points in your first paragraph about the nature of superpowers changing. Unfortunately, we are the first to do this and other countries have grown cocky in their certainty that they can count on our gentle nature. The whole world hates us for eliminating an evil dictator and spending billions to try to liberate the country. We are also sitting upon all this oil and not stealing it. What more could they ask? They still hate us? Well, I hate them too and I think we should take the oil.

I do like the idea of drilling Alaska, though. It would bring many jobs to the USA, and it would keep all oil profits here, rather than just refinery profits.

I would rather we hadn’t donated money to the tsunami relief anyway. That was my money and I didn’t authorize throwing it away on a country with the thickest Muslim population in the world.

Oh, and finally, there is a difference between siphoning gas from a neighbor and taking it from Iraq. My neighbor is a fellow American who worked for his money and purchased his gas. Iraqis are anti-American, loin-cloth wearing savages who just happen to be geographically located above fuel that they are too primitive to have any real use for anyway. Taking the fuel from them means that can’t hoard the money we spend on it to launch terrorist attacks against our troops.

So, have I changed your mind yet?

I’ve been pretty busy, so it’s taken me a few days to get back to this. It’s hard to imagine me being called a hippie. In truth, I’m not a liberal, either. I’m clearly a centrist. In fact, I’m a registered Republican. I originally chose the Republican party because they claimed to support fiscal conservatism, which is just plain not true. Couple that with an appalling disregard for the Constitution, and you’ve got a bunch of disgruntled centrists.

I don’t think the “whole world” hates us for eliminating an evil dictator. In fact, “hate” is too strong a word for what a large portion of the world population (particularly the developed nations) thinks of the US. What people are unhappy about is the US rushing into a pre-emptive war under false pretenses, with complete disregard for international law, and without any rational plan for what happens after the war. By declaring that pre-emptive attacks are a viable strategy, and backing it up with a botched operation, that will likely make many people nervous.

You seem to have a very narrowminded view of Muslims. Not all Muslims in Iraq (or the rest of the world, for that matter) hate us, despite the fact that we’ve thrown them into years of turmoil. Saddam did not lead Iraq alone, however. Those who were in power in Saddam’s regime are likely the ones who continue to attack us. You can bet that they’ll be unhappy for some time to come.

Caring about the environment is no longer a hippie thing today, unless the world’s leading scientists are also hippies. At this point, it’s a matter of survival. The wars that people would go to over oil are nothing like the wars that a global freshwater shortage would result in. Tearing up the wilderness in Alaska for a few months of oil is not a sound long-term strategy.

If you think America hasn’t taken advantage of resources that we happened to be geographically located on, you’re fooling yourself. I would imagine that some of the Brits back in the 1700s would have described Americans as loin-cloth wearing savages. Iraq is just at a different state of development than the US (that’s where the whole “developing world” term comes from).

I don’t think the insurgents attacking our troops are using any great technology that needs lots of funding. Those people are not working under the auspices of the Iraqi government (which we installed), so it is unlikely that they are funded by oil anyhow.

One final note: I’m perfectly willing to have a civil conversation about policy choices. I’m not willing to tolerate bigotry and gross generalizations. Something to keep in mind if you wish to continue the conversation.

I am 20 years old and i do not have alot of strong political views, but i just want to know why oil prices are so high right now? i have had to start working more hours so that i can afford to drive to college and work. i am a sophmore in college taking 16 hours and working close to 40 a week. These gas prices are killing me, so if it calls for stealing gas from iraq or drilling in alaska im all for it. oh and by the way one of you were saying that paying 2.25 a gallon for gas wasn’t that bad compared to some of the other world problems well think about the wide scaled inflation that will soon destroy our economy from the price of gas. the price of gas affects everything except the wealthy, all of the increase is passed directly on the the average consumer who pays the high prices to drive to the store, who also pays the higher price for the product because of the increase in shipping, and who also pays a higher price so the store can pay their workers a higher wage to help them afford the inflation. all and all it is a big circle killing the average man making the seperation of wealth the larger and larger sending us back to the days of the GREAT DEPRESSION.

and one thing to leave with GEORGE W. BUSH IS THE ANTICHRIST

For someone without a lot of strong political views, you expressed two right there…

If we all focus on the here and now and ourselves, we’ll definitely succeed in destroying mankind before we know it. I’m serious about that… we’re inventing more and more ways to destroy ourselves and unless people start taking the long view, one of those ways will come to pass.

Here’s an interesting thing to ponder:
http://www.blueskyonmars.com/2005/07/30/the-long-emergency-peak-oil-and-doom-mongering/

It is contested when “Peak Oil” will happen, but the main thrust is almost certainly accurate: somewhere along the way, the amount of oil produced is going to begin a slow decline. The real fix here is to *stop using so much oil!* That’s it. Hybrid cars, mass transit, hydrogen cells, improved solar power, etc. Imagine if we spent $100 billion on getting our stuff in shape on those fronts, rather than deposing a dictator who *didn’t* have WMD.

Im totally against drilling Alaska.

drill alaska strip the planet of all resources build a big fuckin boat and lets get off this rock

drill in alaska for shere people that way gas wont be so dame expensive. ya

i like to get my excercise so dont drill the dame thing becase i dont wantmy peace of shit car anyway. bye

down were im from we like the wildlife so dont drill the alsaskins only life spand and kill the polor bears u eveil people. bye bye the south will rise.

Rebal until i die

down here we wear skate shoes and blue jeans and PARTY all the time rock on and get stoned.

i like to play 360 all day so i dont have time for some stupid junk like this so drill the darn thing and get a party life and drink and get stoned

ok, so first of all why the hell dont we justy drill in alaska because we only perduce 56% of our own gasoline. second of all how the hell is saudi arabia and iraq swiming in ther gas when we have to pay $2.50 for a gallon??
third of all it will get us thousands of jobs and maybe even get better doctors sp the next time they can teach the next president how to eat a pretzel!!!!
and last why cant we just make anwr smaller and still not kill any animals and drill in the spot we think the oil is and that way we wont kill any animals and this big fight over “alot of animals will die” sckrew the conservationists LETS DRILL ALREADY!!!!!

I agree that we need to reduce our dependence on oil, but it’s not going to happen overnight. It’s not as if we can retrofit every car/suv/truck with hybrid/hydrogen motors by the time we’re paying $85/barrel.

“it’s not going to happen overnight”

If you look at the original posting, it was posted *more than 4 years ago*! If we had started making some serious effort 4 years ago, rather than pandering to buddies in the oil industry (which is generating record profits), we might be in better shape than we are today. Not taking firm steps because things don’t happen overnight is a recipe for disaster (think of global warming).

There’s a band called Drill Alaska. They’re pretty cool, though not really political at all. They’re instrumental. Check ‘em out sometime.

I don’t think we should drill for oil in Alaska. We’re not even positive if there’s a sustainable amount of oil there and why exploit its resources for something we’re not even sure of? In addition, this is also going to lead to lifestyles being disrupted or even destroyed due to drilling. We’re just continuously messing up the land and everyone is becoming too blind to recognize our self-destructing behavior that will inevitably, lead to our non-existance.

This drilling thing… not my style, but hey I’ll say “NO” if I want to. I have a report to do on this thing that is going on, but I never said I for. You other people have your oppinion and I have mine besides we all think differently so express yourself.

I would rather not drill in Alaska, but to say alternative energy is a viable replacement at this point is stretching i think. The transition is going to be slow and we still need oil.